A Conversation with Bill James, Author of "The Accidental Executive"

What roles do resilience, empathy, and finding purpose play in effective leadership? 

Join us as we chat with Bill James, author of The Accidental Executive, about his journey from a GS-1 clerk to the Senior Executive Service. Bill shares candid stories from experiences spanning his 40-year career, highlighting unexpected opportunities, pivotal challenges, and lessons in humility, empathy, and purpose-driven teamwork. 

Be inspired with us as we hear Bill's insights into civil service and the evolving role of technology innovation in government. Bill even shares some valuable advice for anyone considering a career in public service! 

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Transcript

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Any. New. Bill James, thank you so much for joining us today. Well, I'm really thrilled and thank you for having me. Susan. I think this is going to be a great discussion between the two of us and also great for your listeners. Thank you for having me. You bet. So let's dive into the accidental executive finding purpose and public service. I'm really excited to learn more about the book and learn more about the focus of the book for others. So, Bill, what inspired you to write The Accidental Executive? Well, I started my career as a GS one, and for those of you who know civil service, that's the bottom rung of the ladder. And I've heard about others who started as a GS one and made it to the senior Executive service, but I've never met anybody. So I thought, well, my story is unique and different and I'd like to ride it. But beyond that, I really wanted to send the message. And that and the course. The subtitle is Finding Purpose in Public Service. So the the inspiration to actually put those words down on paper were to send the message that public service, particularly the federal civil service, is worth the effort and you can be completely fulfilled in a career like that. So on one hand, it was about the rarity of starting at the bottom and ending at the top of civil service. But really, the thrust and the heart of it was to find purpose in public service and to tell people that it's meaningful and worth it. I love it. So, Bill, why did you choose the title? Well it's funny. I never intended to, shoot for a particular grade. To be honest. And it's in the book. When I started, I thought, you know, if I were to retire as a jazz 11, I thought I would be very, very happy. And so I really never shot for, the, the rank of senior executive service. But at particular points in my career, there were these accidental, you know, vignettes that happened to me which kind of turned and I think it happens to everybody kind of turned the corner. And so only when you turn a corner that you see a new opportunity or a new view, right? And, a lot of these, these opportunities for advancement or a different assignment fell into my lap. And so, I mean, one vignette was like, I went home en from DC back to the Saint Louis area on Easter vacation, and I happened to see in the checkout line, you know, the local day newspaper with an opportunity at the United States Transportation Command. Well, had I not been at that supermarket buying chocolate Easter bunnies for Easter, I never would have seen that, newspaper which changed my career, vector entirely. So it was a series of accidental opportunities that fell in my lap. On the other hand, you had to be prepared to take advantage of them. So it's accidental in one, case. And all those cases. But it's also significant because that means they just don't fall in your lap and they're given to you. You have to be prepared and then go after them. I love it. So you said you started as a GS one. You started as a clerk. What did that role teach you? It was very interesting. First of all, I had no clue, really what the government was about, but it taught me how important it is to be humble. My supervisor was a woman who at the time, I think she was a GS five. But she treated me with such kindness and such empathy. She didn't have to, but that was just her nature. And she understood that it's complicated. And so by learning from her, even at that low level, that you need to be thoughtful and humble and empathetic in order to find your way around through this complex beast of civil service. If you really want to be fulfilled and actually contribute. So that just one assignment was really one of the most kind of pivotal and fundamental in my entire career. So you mentioned a pivotal moment. You have one that you had shared with me about involving a sexual harassment early in your career. Why did you include that? Right? That's a great question. And I did because I thought it was important and a little bit different from my perspective, you know, as a straight male. Right. So when I vignette was, National Security Agency and I was there, looking to be hired and was going through the battery of tests, and one of the people who were giving the test, asked me for a sexual favor in return for getting a better grade or passing that particular part of the exam. And I was so. And it's this part of this vignette, this in the book. But I was so taken aback by that, that someone could take advantage or would want to take advantage of their power in order to basically trade that for personal services or favors that it upset me as as it should upset anybody who gets really kind of cornered in that situation. So I wanted to share that because I feel like it created a foundation for me where integrity in a workplace has to be more than simply a picture or a poster on the break room wall, which we all see, it has to be real. And, and at that point, it fundamentally changed the way I looked at in the workplace and the workplace setting and our responsibilities as managers, or even if you're not a manager or a supervisor, as an employee, to call out things when things are wrong, right, and to get them fixed. And so, it was, fundamentally kind of changed my perspective or at least informed me about the power dynamic that's really at work in any large organization. Thanks for sharing that, bill. So how did your upbringing in Lebanon, Illinois, near Scott Air Force Base influence your leadership style? Well, you know, growing up in the small town, near an Air force base, first of all, you grow up in an Air Force culture, right? And you learn about the air Force culture. And because all of your friends, generally speaking, our, our Air force, or at least related to somebody is in the Air Force. So that's really the foundation of a lot of the lessons I learned. But also in the small town, like in my book, I talk about my dad used to say, if something doesn't work, like, you know, a tool you're working on or a little project, you know, turn it upside down and try it again. So I used to we used to work on UN cars together. And whenever you had some little boat or something you're trying to work on, you know, it never fit into the, you know, the hole that you're trying to screw it into. So his plan was, well, turn it upside down and try it again. Now that would not work. You know, everybody knows it would not work. But the point being is that turn your perspective around. So it's not just the object that you're trying to fix. Or they had this tool you have in your hand, but consider moving to the left or moving to the right, and you get a different perspective on what you're trying to achieve. Now that's the lesson, right? So, the idea of turning something upside down and trying it again, it's more than just turn the thing that's in your hand. It's turn the thing that's in your brain upside down and gain a different perspective. And so the military culture I thought was valuable. And I really respect those who served in the military, obviously, you know, working at the VA, you get to see the veterans are all former military folks. And then, you know, learning about how to be resilient and persistent, you know, in the face of challenges in front of you. That's awesome. So, Bill, what was your most challenging moment in public service? Well, there were a lot of them, but I think the most pressurized one was during, Desert Shield, Desert Storm. Now I'm a civilian. Always the last one to see, so I never wear the or the military uniform, but. And DoD, the civilians are part of the force structure, just embedded inside of it. So during Desert Shield, Desert Storm, we had a computer outage, on the worldwide military command and control system and the pressure to get that, system, that particular application that was ours to maintain software application, the pressure to get that back up and running was really significant, because a lot of things, counted on that software application. And I think what it taught me at that point was you have to use the power of your organization. And, you know, I this was like 3:00 in the morning and I'm still walking the halls, looking for inspiration or thought. And I happened to run across, a very young coder who turns out had the key to, resolving and bringing the system back together. So you just never know. But I think it's the power of the team that, I learned there. Is that someone in your organization, if you give them a chance, will have the key to solving the problem or the challenge that you're facing. Now, you know, let's face it, we all have, constraints on resources. And sometimes you don't have enough resources to get the job done. But if you're looking for innovation, you know, you have to look for it in your team and assume that it's there and give them the opportunity to offer it up. And so, you know, that particular challenge worked out and was fixed at the end of the day, but it wasn't fixed because of me, but it was fixed because we opened the aperture to, okay, who here has a wild and crazy idea and then invite them in. And so that was a very powerful lesson I learned there. I just love that. So, Bill, you spent time both in government and private sectors. What did you learn from each? I tell you, government is is challenging because you live in a bureaucracy and there's a very structured, framework in which you work. Resources are always limited, but particularly in DoD, what I learned was mission first, focusing on mission, that North Star, keeping that above the fray of day to day activities that can give you the at least a gave me the perspective to be patient and persevere because you're focusing on the mission, not the challenges that all of us face on a day by day basis. When I left the Pentagon in 97 and went to the private sector, I spent almost 20 years, spinning around the Beltway and various federal system integrators, small and medium and large companies. And there I learned adaptability. You know, there's, let's face it, profit is the one of the driving factors. Culture is important, too. Obviously, you can't be successful without a good culture, but at the end of the day, that to be adaptable and you have to be really focused on what you can do for your clients and what you can do for your company from a profitability standpoint. So adaptability there was the lesson that I took. And then finally, when I returned back to civil service and ended up working at the Department of Veterans Affairs, it was really, the cherry on top of the ice cream of my career because it was the most fulfilling assignment I've ever had. And any any, job, private sector or public sector. We haven't talked about this, but, you know, as an IT guy in the DoD or in many other, you know, organizations, you are many layers removed from an outcome. So you might write a piece of code that goes into a program that go someplace else, that goes at the end of that chain. There is a human outcome positive. Or in the case of De, you know, some kind of sometimes negative, but there's a human outcome. But the the relationship between what you did on the computer and that human outcome is hard to see. Right. It's way beyond the horizon. But at VA and I think in some of the, some agencies also like maybe Social Security Administration, but in VA particularly the outcome is direct. There is a kiosk and the medical center that a veteran touches, there's, you know, an app on their mobile device that they use to make an appointment or confirm an appointment or a prescription. That immediacy and that directness from an IT perspective is so fulfilling. It's just energizing. It makes you passionate about the mission. So I just think that anybody wanting to work in it and in the government, when you can find an organization or a mission that gives that immediacy and that direct feedback, and you feel good about what you can do for your fellow human beings, that's really where fulfillment can be found. I love it, Bill. You talked a lot about separately people, process and technology. You brought that to the VA in a big way. Can you talk more about that? I mean, you were able to lead so many important programs for the Department of Veterans Affairs, but that directly impacted veterans as you just shared. Talk more about that. Well, one of the things I used to say, and I still say it all the time, was, DevOps, you know, this whole idea of software development and the operation, DevOps equals empathy. So I think if you're in the IT business, you have to think beyond the code at your fingertips and beyond the budget that, you know, really funds the coding that you're doing or you're having done. And think about, being empathetic. And it started out with the idea that the software teams, many cases and many organizations, they write the code, they throw it over the fence and then the hardware teams, the infrastructure teams have to run it, right, like back in the old days, in the batch days, where they'd have software writers and you write the code and then a batch, team would come in and they would run the program overnight, as I did in the data center. There was a division between the people writing the code and the people running the code. And frankly, that division, actually was in place to some degree at VA as well. So the idea of empathy started with, look, if if you're writing code, your code bombs out at two in the morning. You, as the writer, should be concerned about that. You should be the one you should want that 2:00 pm phone call because you're responsible, right? You should be empathetic in a way that you're writing code that will run properly for the infrastructure teams and vice versa. The infrastructure team should write should create an environment that the code writers and can be successful. So they need to. They need to be thinking about each other and their day to day job. But then if you put a can or a string around the IT group, they need to think outside of their cylinder and to the business areas. And in the case of VA, the veteran veterans benefits or the veterans health administrations, how are they able to use what you're developing and producing to serve veterans and then finally, how does what you do empathetically really deliver outcomes for the veterans, really the customers of what you're doing? So there's layers of empathy. But I think it comes down to empathy. And so that's why I always say DevOps equals empathy because you're caring about someone else. And many different layers. Ultimately you're caring about the customer or in our case at the VA, the veteran who is, benefiting from what you were doing. I love it. And there was so much that was done with your leadership in such an efficient way. So congratulations on the great work you were driving. Yeah. Thank you. I think back then, and of course I've been doing consulting since then, but I'm still very passionate about what the VA is doing and particularly the IT organization. I think the cloud was a big, you know, game changer and VA's ability to, kind of move the needle on on offering it services. And it's really going to open up a lot of, frankly, a lot of innovation, a lot of opportunity for AI as we move forward, you know, moving data, moving applications to the cloud is one thing. But really, when you move the application, you're also pulling the data along. And once the data is on a platform, that's accessible now, I can get at it. So I think in a lot of ways, you know, there's we've just begun the opportunity for innovation at VA and many other agencies too, but particularly the VA. And it's founded on, on really kind of making the strategic decisions necessary to be prepared for these new technologies. Like I thank you, Bill. It's a very exciting time to be in government service. So what advice would you give someone considering a career in civil service? First of all, my advice would be do it, but focus on mission and focus on purpose. And, if you can focus on those things beyond yourself, right? Focus on really the the outcomes that you're trying to achieve for what whoever the customers are of your particular agency or your particular department, then I think you can find fulfillment. So finding purpose in public service and in my case being fulfilled by that, really what I think is the key takeaway, the book and frankly, it's, it's the the end result of a, you know, 40 year career in civil service. For me. Graduation. So you included a guide to reaching the senior executive service. Why? Well, first of all, in many cases, a lot of folks look at the senior executive service as a pay raise right here, GS 15, they think, hey, I get more pay at the SCS level nowadays. So in some cases that's not really true very much because of the pay down compressions at the top. But still, you know, there's there's this, I think a myth about what an X is about. And frankly, it's kind of the leading myth. It's about the money and it's not. So what I wanted to do is, first of all, dispel some myths about what the senior executive service was for me and what I found it to be after, working in it for so many years. And then secondly, okay, with that foundation, that baseline, what I think the SCS is truly about. Then I said, well, if you're still interested in it, how do you get there? Right. What are the steps needed to become. And she has lately, OPM that's changed some of the, you know, the requirements in order to get an. Yeah. So I wrote this basically a supplement, another chapter about how to become. And now she has all the steps necessary to be prepared for it. And then I also but I in every case, I wanted people to understand that it's more than a pay raise. Right. You're really committing to becoming a strategic leader, and you're committing to to be a leader in the sense that you want to drive the organization to serve the customers of that agency. So it's, more than a cookbook. It's not a cookbook, per se. It's here are the steps necessary to get there. In my view. And here's the why behind it. Right. Why do you want that? And once you understand the why, and if you're still interested in pursuing it, then here's the how. I love it. Bill, thank you so much for even thinking about including that in the book. So what do you hope readers and listeners take away from your story? I think the the power of purpose really is the is the bumper sticker. That it's first of all worth it. And look, I get it. A career in civil service is challenging. It's not glamorous. There's the old civil service bargain. We used to say we're a lifetime of relatively lower pay than you can get in the private sector. And, of course, the trade off is you generally get, a higher level of, and basically surety, you know, of your, of your career, less turbulence, but there's a trade off that's made there. And, so I really wanted folks to understand that book. This is tough, but it's worth it. And, and a lot of people are looking for fulfillment, even if they're not in the civil service. If you're in a management, you know, in the private sector and you say, man, you know, this isn't really it doesn't feel good to go to work every day. I think if you are searching for the why, then purpose is the answer. So, in my view, this is something that's not only for civil service, but also for the private sector. Kind of the find the why, find the purpose, find really the service that you can offer. And and that way you can be fulfilled, I think, and from a career perspective. So you say your book is a labor of love and legacy. What do you mean by that? And how could our listeners benefit from that? Well, it's a labor of love, because first of all, allow me to reflect on those moments and challenges and the triumphs that shaped my life. And frankly, when I first started this book, somebody asked me, well, what's the champagne moment? And I thought, well, it's probably if my my kids actually read it, you know, it's saying, way to go, dad. You know, so and in many ways it's, it's that part of, you know, the love for your family. But, it also allowed me to share the love of, really, this career and civil service and the people that I worked with along the way. You can't work with, folks in the military or, frankly, other civilians in the civil service without really appreciating the challenges and the sacrifices they make, really, to to have this as a career. So, that's the love part and the legacy part was I wanted to leave behind more than just a resumé, you know, I wanted to share the lessons that I learned in public service, especially for those who were considering it. But, you know, there is a legacy there that some may choose to follow or not. But I think learning about it, learning about how it it's challenging, but how it can be fulfilling, it's really part of the legacy that I wanted to communicate. So civil service may not be glamorous, but it certainly can be fulfilling. And so that was the legacy part that I wanted to communicate. I love it, Bill, thank you so much for taking the time to talk with me today, and I look forward to talking with you more about some great work that you've been doing across the board. Thank you for having me. Susan. This is this is great, and I'm looking forward to working with you in the future too. You. Get. Me. In. You.